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Binding?
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Jeff Cairns
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PostPosted: 2011-07-17, 14:13    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

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I'm totally with you on those ideas Brian. Maybe Kyoto if you're coming.
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Brian Tairaku Ritchie
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PostPosted: 2011-07-17, 14:57    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

I will be there even if I have to swim!
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Ryuraku
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PostPosted: 2011-07-17, 16:31    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Hi Folks,
I've seen flutes where the inlaid bindings are so tight, and the bamboo wall thinned by removing material for the inlay, that you can actually see ring-like indentations inside the bore. Know what I mean? Wouldn't this effect the sound of the flute? Anyone have an opinion? What are the ramifications of this? Just wondering.
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Jeff Cairns
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PostPosted: 2011-07-18, 01:14    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

I've never seen that, but I would say in that case that either the bamboo wasn't madake and the wall was too thin to begin with and/or the person who did the binding didn't have a lot of experience at it, but more than likely all of that together. To do binding properly is an acquired skill and some even consider an art. The experienced craftsman would make the right judgement call and realize that the wall was too thin to do inlaid binding in the first place and opt for another method.
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knowshit
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PostPosted: 2011-07-18, 09:09    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

I visited Tom Deaver once, and there was a 2.4 he had made that had cracked badly, and been sent back to him for repair. He had bound the top half with inlays and it had squeezed the bamboo so that there were visible bumps inside. He said the sound was affected, and had given the owner a new 2.4 in exchange.
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x moran
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PostPosted: 2011-07-21, 04:41    Post subject: Other Franken-shaku images with bindings Reply with quote

Other Franken-shaku images with bindings
This is the 2.35 Taimu from mujitsu.com that Tairaku now has. A massive shakuhachi. The #4 hole is something like 16mm. My fingers would disappear inside of the holes.





Massive chinrest and iki-gaeshi. Reminds me of Half Dome in Yosemite.
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Toby
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PostPosted: 2011-08-04, 17:20    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Thomas wrote:
Hi Folks,
I've seen flutes where the inlaid bindings are so tight, and the bamboo wall thinned by removing material for the inlay, that you can actually see ring-like indentations inside the bore. Know what I mean? Wouldn't this effect the sound of the flute? Anyone have an opinion? What are the ramifications of this? Just wondering.


Terry NcGee, who makes and restores classical wooden flutes, is doing a study on how wrapped tenons in old flutes can deform the bore, and yes, it will have some effect on the sound, but not as much as if it were nearer the utaguchi. Mostl likely it would lead to intonation or response problems on specific notes with acoustic antinodes in the area of the constriction.

Toby
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Toby
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PostPosted: 2011-08-04, 17:23    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Brian Tairaku Ritchie wrote:
If you want decorative bindings rattan is OK but if you want something to hold the flute together and stop it from cracking you're better off with nylon.


Many people are now using stainless steel wire inlaid, and then soldered. It is much stronger than nylon and will not stretch at all. You can also then not cut the channel as deep.
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Brian Tairaku Ritchie
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PostPosted: 2011-08-04, 20:10    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Toby wrote:

Many people are now using stainless steel wire inlaid, and then soldered. It is much stronger than nylon and will not stretch at all. You can also then not cut the channel as deep.


They are using this on shakuhachi? I have not seen it. Do you have a picture of the process?
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CharlesKoeppen
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PostPosted: 2011-08-05, 16:50    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Toby wrote:


Many people are now using stainless steel wire inlaid, and then soldered. It is much stronger than nylon and will not stretch at all. You can also then not cut the channel as deep.



I thought the stretchiness of nylon was a good thing because pressure would continue to be applied even when the bamboo material it is containing shrinks a little. With topical bindings I've noticed that if the binding material doesn't have any stretchiness it becomes loose eventually.
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Toby
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PostPosted: 2011-08-06, 00:54    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Brian Tairaku Ritchie wrote:
Toby wrote:

Many people are now using stainless steel wire inlaid, and then soldered. It is much stronger than nylon and will not stretch at all. You can also then not cut the channel as deep.


They are using this on shakuhachi? I have not seen it. Do you have a picture of the process?


No pictures, sorry, but it is the process I use. A channel is cut as normal, and then thin stainless wire is wrapped in the channel as you would with nylon, something like a double layer. Not as much pressure needs to be applied since the wire is rigid. After that the wire is covered with stainless solder flux and normal lead/tin solder applied with a fairly powerful iron (something like 60 watt). The solder flows all around the wire by capillary action, making, in essence, a solid metal band. I'm not sure why one would want stretchiness, since that would not stop the bamboo from swelling again. All I know is that on the flutes I have made, I have not had a problem using this technique. It was taught to me at Meijiro.
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Itamar Foguel
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PostPosted: 2011-08-06, 10:08    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

interesting, and new! thanks!
but so far since i got the tuff cord number 6 it have done wonders, really happy about this string, its like the - "ultimate" string....
revived some terribly cracked flutes into something magnificent

and also in contrast to the stainless steel method, it was able to close cracks that were still open.
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Toby
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PostPosted: 2011-08-06, 14:02    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Itamar Foguel wrote:
interesting, and new! thanks!
but so far since i got the tuff cord number 6 it have done wonders, really happy about this string, its like the - "ultimate" string....
revived some terribly cracked flutes into something magnificent

and also in contrast to the stainless steel method, it was able to close cracks that were still open.


Here's perhaps a better method: buy some automobile hose clamps of the right diameter. Hydrate the flute to narrow the cracks as much as possible, then slip a clamp or clamps onto the flute cushioned by a thin rubber strip between the metal and the bamboo to avoid surface scarring. Now simply tighten the clamps until the crack is closed and bind at your leisure. You can use a number of clamps to close a large crack across an entire joint, and fine-adjust them individually to avoid further cracking while closing the original crack.

This takes all the strain out of closing the crack. BTW I am not advocating using the stainless method for exterior binding. You would want to cut a channel which is later filled to the right depth, and then finished flush to the surface with rattan. The soldered wire would be extremely ugly if visible.
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Jon Palombi
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PostPosted: 2011-08-07, 06:14    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

Fascinating. Okay
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De Fouw
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PostPosted: 2011-08-07, 14:42    Post subject: Binding? Reply with quote

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Last edited by De Fouw on 2011-10-11, 10:28; edited 1 time in total
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