ESS Shakuhachi Forum Forum Index ESS Shakuhachi Forum
Practice, Culture and History of Japanese Bamboo Flute 尺八. A Project of the European Shakuhachi Society (ESS)
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing
Goto page: <  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ESS Shakuhachi Forum Forum Index -> ESS Forums -> The Dōjō
Previous topic :: Next topic  
Author Message
Brian Tairaku Ritchie
Moderator

Offline

Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 635
Localisation: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 10:34    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

PublicitéSupprimer les publicités ?
Yep Jam forums are good places to talk about these things and your comments are most welcome. Okay
Back to top
Jam
Member

Offline

Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 78
Localisation: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 14:36    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

CharlesKoeppen wrote:
Jam wrote:
I just don't see why they feel the need to!


Personally, I find street performers interesting and are what the musical experience is about, they demonstrate that any individual who has the ambition can enjoy it even if the results of recording aren't up to the quality of a shakuhachi professional with state of the art recording technology. In disliking them one is essentially censoring music availability to only music produced commercially, so please, be careful of what you wish for.


Whoa, hang on a minute mate! I didn't say anything about censorship! Incidentally, once I realise that the video i've clicked on and started listening to is, in my opinion, rubbish, I stop listening.

There is a LOT of dross on youtube. I'm not talking about semi-pro/pro players, or indeed talented players that no-one has heard of. I'm talking about people who have evidently only been playing shakuhachi for a year or so, burbling out noise and thinking it's a good idea to show the world on youtube/spam facebook with it.

I'm also a bass guitarist, and if I uploaded a video of myself playing badly, I'd get torn apart on youtube. There's this attitude that because shakuhachi is a "zen" instrument (whole other can of worms!) that you can play whatever you want and it's somehow spiritual, no matter how bad it may sound.

IMHO, obviously.
Back to top
CharlesKoeppen
Member

Offline

Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 103
Localisation: ny usa

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 16:21    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Jam wrote:
...There's this attitude that because shakuhachi is a "zen" instrument (whole other can of worms!) that you can play whatever you want and it's somehow spiritual, no matter how bad it may sound.



But isn't everything spiritual anyway? Very Happy So you censor yourself by not uploading under-par playing. That's fine, the process going on in your mind dealing with your thought that your playing is not good enough can be looked at as spiritually advancing, just as long as you don't get stuck there and it continues to be a process. Just as those who decide to upload their amateur videos, with a "damn the torpedoes" attitude, are going through a personal growth process that may be looked upon as spiritual.

I often turn off videos even with "good" playing long before the end of the video. And then there are some amateur videos with sub-par playing where for some reason I am drawn to watch the whole thing. Even with non-shakuhachi music performance videos with lots of negative comments you'll usually find at least some positive comments. I'm not saying that everyone should upload their music even if they are not satisfied with their performance, but with such a wide audience there are at least some viewers that are appreciative and grateful for the performance. Should the individuals who uploaded the videos have denied that experience to those viewers?

We've got plenty of storage space, I do not see any problem with amateurs uploading and publicly documenting their progress.

Jam wrote:

IMHO, obviously.


Same for me too Okay

P.S. I'd also rather see videos of musicians crashing and burning than the ever so popular viral videos of amateur daredevils crashing and burning.
_________________
Charles Koeppen
Kingston NY USA
Visit my shakuhachi website http://shakuhachi.atspace.cc
Back to top
Visit poster’s website
Kenny
Member

Offline

Joined: 03 Aug 2011
Posts: 7
Localisation: Scotland, UK

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 17:58    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Jam wrote:


There is a LOT of dross on youtube. I'm not talking about semi-pro/pro players, or indeed talented players that no-one has heard of. I'm talking about people who have evidently only been playing shakuhachi for a year or so, burbling out noise and thinking it's a good idea to show the world on youtube/spam facebook with it.

I'm also a bass guitarist, and if I uploaded a video of myself playing badly, I'd get torn apart on youtube. There's this attitude that because shakuhachi is a "zen" instrument (whole other can of worms!) that you can play whatever you want and it's somehow spiritual, no matter how bad it may sound.

IMHO, obviously.


You'll never find an easy one size fits all answer as to why someone posts to youtube. I've done it for various reasons. I have no aspiration to become a serious 'musician' (again if I ever was) therefore perhaps I have nothing to loose. When I was in an 'indie' band in the late 80's early 90's I maybe would have felt like you do and been unhappy with some awful live gigs hitting youtube , it's hard to know, I've changed a lot since then.

I post occasional playings of odd flutes I've bought after I've learned to get enough of a sound out of them to play the equivalent of a nursery rhyme Very Happy

I've done this because friends on far away places have wanted to see me play something, or because I've made an instrument and want to play test it on video, or cause I particularly like the tone/sound of a clip, or because other friends are upping practice videos and I feel inspired to copy, or because I know I'm going to stop playing the instrument and want something recorded for posterity, or because I feel a sense of achievement and want to share my joy (I currently feel a sense of achievement whenever I hit kan with any reliability but so far have refrained from posting any shak videos, yet! lol). Lots of different reasons - I just think it's fun and must have a thick skin I guess. I always like finding people similar to myself Laughing

The internet is however an unforgiving place and people, as you say, are all too quick to tear into others efforts which is a shame. I like raw, cheap, earnest music and there's plenty of that on youtube Okay

Each to there own I guess.

Kenny
Back to top
Jam
Member

Offline

Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 78
Localisation: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 20:55    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Interesting points from both of you, with some things I hadn't considered. I don't think any less of people for posting their videos on Youtube, I was just unsure as to the logic behind it. Makes some sense, but I still don't think I'd do it myself!

Kenny, I didn't know there were any shakuhachi players north of the border! Good luck with your playing, let me know when you upload some videos of your shakuhachi playing Okay
Back to top
Kenny
Member

Offline

Joined: 03 Aug 2011
Posts: 7
Localisation: Scotland, UK

PostPosted: 2012-06-20, 21:47    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Jam wrote:
Good luck with your playing


Thanks I'll need it!! In fact I think I seriously need to find a teacher. This instrument has turned out to be a whole lot more frustrating that I expected and I thought I was prepared for that.

I liked the comment Charles made comparing youtube videos to buskers, at least with youtube you can click away quickly. I'd pay some of the buskers in Glasgow good money to stop if it would work. There is dross out there, for me that would comprise most of the big earners in pop/rock, I'm outnumbered lol!

Jam I expect when you make your youtube entrance it'll be a pretty fine performance and I look forward to it Okay

Kenny
Back to top
Jam
Member

Offline

Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 78
Localisation: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: 2012-06-21, 23:50    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

I'm always impressed with people who teach themselves shakuhachi, even with a teacher it can be very frustrating, so it's definitely very admirable!

...also definitely with you on the pop/rock dross, and the buskers!
Back to top
GalinaSG
Member

Offline

Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Posts: 74
Localisation: Moscow, Russia

PostPosted: 2012-06-22, 10:44    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

CharlesKoeppen wrote:
Jam wrote:
I just don't see why they feel the need to!


For me, guilty of it just a year or so ago and earlier, it is sort of like playing in the park, but internet users are strolling about and will be the audience rather an individual enjoying a park. Of course, just as some people complain if a park, street, or subway performer isn't so good, some people complain if a youtube performer isn't so good.

Personally, I find street performers interesting and are what the musical experience is about, they demonstrate that any individual who has the ambition can enjoy it even if the results of recording aren't up to the quality of a shakuhachi professional with state of the art recording technology. In disliking them one is essentially censoring music availability to only music produced commercially, so please, be careful of what you wish for.


Oh, this is point of view I completetely agree with.
I do not record myself (red button phobia, you know Neutral ), but sometimes I play in the park. Some people walk by with no attention, some stop and listen for a while, some approach and tell "thank you for playing, this is what this place was missing this very moment". I do not overestimate my playing, absolutely, I just consider it as practice of public performance.
Back to top
Skype
Fiona Dawes
Member

Offline

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 53
Localisation: Canberra

PostPosted: 2012-06-24, 08:10    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Hi

I think there is scope on you-tube for video images of practice exercises without shakuhachi; for time spent standing in line at the supermarket; or on the bus, potentially a you-tube embarrassment waiting to happen; but only for a beginner. I am thinking of blowing rasberries.

Embarassed

From The Iron Flute 100 Zen Koan

Shao-shan's Phrase

A monk once asked Shao-shan, "Is there any phrase which is neither right nor wrong?" Shao-shan answered, "A piece of white cloud does not show any ugliness"
Back to top
DaveW
Member

Offline

Joined: 03 Apr 2011
Posts: 28
Localisation: Australia

PostPosted: 2012-06-26, 13:06    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

GalinaSG wrote:
CharlesKoeppen wrote:
Jam wrote:
I just don't see why they feel the need to!


For me, guilty of it just a year or so ago and earlier, it is sort of like playing in the park, but internet users are strolling about and will be the audience rather an individual enjoying a park. Of course, just as some people complain if a park, street, or subway performer isn't so good, some people complain if a youtube performer isn't so good.

Personally, I find street performers interesting and are what the musical experience is about, they demonstrate that any individual who has the ambition can enjoy it even if the results of recording aren't up to the quality of a shakuhachi professional with state of the art recording technology. In disliking them one is essentially censoring music availability to only music produced commercially, so please, be careful of what you wish for.


Oh, this is point of view I completetely agree with.
I do not record myself (red button phobia, you know Neutral ), but sometimes I play in the park. Some people walk by with no attention, some stop and listen for a while, some approach and tell "thank you for playing, this is what this place was missing this very moment". I do not overestimate my playing, absolutely, I just consider it as practice of public performance.


Good points too Galina. Like you, I like to take my flute outdoors. In my case I play on a platform in a relatively secluded walk area by the river. Not so much for practice at performing publicly but rather because I just like to be outdoors and I like to hear the naturalness of sound and how it changes externally. I particularly liked the response you got. Isn't it amazing how we can transform environmental space with music. And as your people said - you were exactly what was needed in that park in that moment. Nice Smile
Back to top
Brian Tairaku Ritchie
Moderator

Offline

Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 635
Localisation: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia

PostPosted: 2012-06-27, 02:29    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Playing outside is a big part of developing a good sound. People who never play outside have weak tone.
Back to top
Fiona Dawes
Member

Offline

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 53
Localisation: Canberra

PostPosted: 2012-07-01, 10:48    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

Feedback is good too.

When practicing in public people would most often approach me with some concern, saying 'that looks very difficult, how long have you been playing?'
I particularly enjoyed when one fellow suggested why don't I take up the harmonica, in all seriousness.

More practice and perhaps I can make it look effortless; and like I am enjoying playing the shakuhachi.
Back to top
Jam
Member

Offline

Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 78
Localisation: Oxford, UK

PostPosted: 2012-07-02, 00:22    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

I like playing outside too, it's good training, especially when it's windy!

Some Japanese friends did a fundraising cake sale shortly after the Tsunami hit Tohoku and sold them on the main street in Oxford. They asked me to play next to them while they sold and it was a good experience. I did end up having some little teenage scrotes trying to beatbox over my playing which was quite distracting though! I think they were trying to put me off...
Back to top
Fiona Dawes
Member

Offline

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 53
Localisation: Canberra

PostPosted: 2012-07-07, 10:18    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing Reply with quote

When someone suggested that I take up the harmonica it was with genuine concern that, despite my efforts, I was never going to get a folk tune out of my instrument.

I would like to hear more about WSF 2012; did anyone follow the folk musicians? I understand Riley felt that this form and these exponents were neglected in the WSF 2008.

I am listening to the talk about playing outside.
Back to top
Jon Palombi
Member

Offline

Joined: 11 May 2011
Posts: 78
Localisation: Vermont, USA

PostPosted: 2012-07-16, 03:33    Post subject: 9 Reply with quote

Honestly, for myself the shakuhachi IS the ideal embodiment of Nature's greatest attributes and characteristics. It is the ever-changing balance and the path. Playing this flute in the deep forest, by the sea, under the star-filled sky, beside a mountain stream or roaring waterfall... completes a circle which began turning before my first breath was drawn and released; brings me back to exactly where I began this journey. This is what I was initially so impressed by, way back in the 70's, when I first heard this lovely and enigmatic voice from the Far East. Something natural, spontaneous, seasoned, forever renewed and pure... something both empty and oh, so full of living spiritual expression. Okay

And I wholly agree with Brian, one's playing cannot improve significantly, towards the authenticity and power which the original Komuso so freely expressed, if hiding behind digital echo effects and playing in stair wells or high-ceiling rooms, awesome as it sounds (arguably). The sheer scope and grandeur of Nature calls us to bring something else to the table, to reach a little deeper and blow with renewed conviction. Practice outdoors challenges us to bring our breath & flute-voice to another level, altogether. Ray Brookes comes to mind, amongst others.

If it wasn't raining so damn hard, I'd go outside right now and continue my humble training. What the hell.. it's time to break out the PVC, don my floppy hat & raincoat and step outdoors before the inspiration passes. The moment has arrived for me to empty myself enough to harmonize with the rushing winds and thumping rain drops (if I can even hear myself, neophyte that I am). Embarassed
_________________
Music is the very breath of life.
Back to top
Contenu Sponsorisé






PostPosted: Today at 12:18    Post subject: Uploading recordings/videos of yourself playing

Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ESS Shakuhachi Forum Forum Index -> ESS Forums -> The Dōjō All times are GMT + 2 Hours
Goto page: <  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  

Index | Create a free forum | Free support forum | Free forums directory | Report a violation | Conditions générales d'utilisation
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2017 phpBB Group